This is a rush transcript from “Hannity,” February 5, 2010. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
TUCKER CARLSON, GUEST HOST: Welcome back. Earlier this week, Sean sat down with the pastors of Lakewood Church, Joel and Victoria Osteen. They covered a number of topics, from the scandal surrounding John Edwards, to the tragedy now unfolding in Haiti. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEAN HANNITY, HOST: The crowds are huge. You have one of the biggest ministries. Now, you’re also a pastor. I did not know that.
VICTORIA OSTEEN, CO-PASTOR, LAKEWOOD CHURCH: I’m a co-pastor. I’m a co-pastor. I’m the…
HANNITY: All right. What does that mean?
V. OSTEEN: He’s the big chief. And I just the neck.
HANNITY: But I’ve seen you — I’ve seen you also preach.
V. OSTEEN: I do.
HANNITY: You do.
V. OSTEEN: I get up, and I take a part of every service. And — and, you know, I enjoy it. I don’t — you know, I — he usually delivers the main message, but I do an encouraging part, and I like it. It’s great.
It’s wonderful to love on the people.
HANNITY: You know, I spoke recently to this guy Andrew Young. All right. This is the guy that was involved with John Edwards.
And here’s John Edwards running for president of the United States. All right. He’s having this huge affair. Everybody knows, including his wife, he’s having the affair.
In Andrew Young’s case he starts out loving John Edwards. Then he becomes knowledgeable of this, stays with him. Then he facilitates the affair. Then he helps cover the affair. Then he claims paternity for the child.
I asked Dr. Phil earlier — earlier in the week about — about the psychology of it. What is the spiritual side of this? What happens that somebody can get that disconnected that they still think they can be president but they can be living this life?
JOEL OSTEEN, PASTOR, LAKEWOOD CHURCH: You know, I think people get — it’s easy to get deceived. It’ s easy to believe, I guess deception is to believe the lie you keep feeding it. You know, one lie leads to another, and the first one wasn’t so bad.
And that’s why it’s so important every night, every morning at some point in your life to come back to that place of peace and search your own heart and say, “OK, am I making right decisions?” If not, now is the time to stop, because it’s only going to get deeper and deeper.
HANNITY: You have to examine it everyday. It’s not something that you can say, you know, like on test day, “Gee, you know, dear Lord, give me, you know, an A in my class?”
J. OSTEEN: Yes. I think it’s on a daily basis. Because it’s too easy — because, you know, just a slight degree off, in three years down the road, and you’re a hundred miles off.
HANNITY: But this is really — if we’re going to be honest, you probably see a lot more of this than I do. Adultery is an epidemic in this country, right?
V. OSTEEN: Yes, it is. I think a lot of people get into it, and they think they can get out of it. And everyday, they’re going, “I’m going to get out of it.” But it just gets deeper and deeper, and the deception and the web gets further and further.
HANNITY: Do you counsel? Do you both counsel people that are living through this? And — because isn’t this the one area where the Bible says divorce is justifiable?
J. OSTEEN: Well, I believe it is. It is. And we do counsel with people and talk with them often. And, you know, our — we counsel them after the fact. And then we kind of encourage them before the fact that temptation comes to every one of us. It’s so important to guard your own heart, guard your eyes, keep your thoughts in the right place. And I think it’s a lot easier to stop something before it starts.
HANNITY: All right. We have this, and I understand, you know, you have been working with the people — the victims of this horrible earthquake in Haiti, which has been devastating. Tell us what you’re involved in.
J. OSTEEN: First off, Sean, my brother is a surgeon. He went down the last couple of weeks, and he spent time there just operating with Samaritan’s Purse. Samaritan’s Purse.
HANNITY: That’s Franklin Graham’s group.
J. OSTEEN: Yes, Franklin Graham. A great group. And so he’s been doing that.
And then we have other doctors in our church that we send supplies and just send to people that we can. And, you know, most of all, we’re raising money and praying for the people down there.
HANNITY: Yes. It’s pretty devastating. And you’re involved in this, too?
V. OSTEEN: Yes, we are. You know, it is interesting, because we were — we were getting supplies that were just simple things, like bandages, aspirin, just small little things. You know, sometimes we think, you know, what do they need? But even small things are great. So we always tell people, you know, your gift is never too small, because it can help someone.
HANNITY: Is it — you know, I remember Alan asked you this question once, and you know, how — how does God let this happen? And people do ask that question.
I don’t really ask that, because I don’t think we really have any — I don’t think we really can even begin to understand the concept of God. That may sound a little strange. But the Bible even says that your eye hasn’t seen, your ear hasn’t heard. It’s not entered into your heart what God has in store for us. So it’s hard to understand the concept, right?
J. OSTEEN: Exactly right. You can’t figure out things like that. God is a sovereign God. And we know that God is good, but we don’t live in a perfect world. I mean, the scripture talks about Jesus said, “In this world, you will have difficulties.” One place even talks about there will be famines and earthquakes and wars. And so you got to come back to that place of trust where you know God is in control.
HANNITY: Didn’t Jesus also say we’re all kind of evil? I mean, he said, do I call me good? It’s only my father.
J. OSTEEN: I think — and that’s exactly right. I think…
HANNITY: So we’re all evil?
J. OSTEEN: Well…
HANNITY: Even Joel Osteen? For crying out loud, there’s no hope for us!
J. OSTEEN: You know, I think that’s in us. But when you come to know Christ he makes you righteous. He makes you clean and whole. But…
HANNITY: But you still keep messing up. I mean, even in small ways. You may not mess up in the big ways, like you used to. But you keep still — why do we keep still messing up?
J. OSTEEN: Well, you know what? I think it’s a process. We’re all growing. God is working on each one of us. And hopefully, we’re better this year than we were last year. Maybe some people aren’t. But…
HANNITY: Does he mess up a lot?
V. OSTEEN: All the time. No, just kidding.
HANNITY: You guys check each other?
V. OSTEEN: We do.
HANNITY: You do?
V. OSTEEN: We keep each other on course. We’re really honest with each other. We give constructive criticism.
HANNITY: You ever fight? I asked you that once before.
V. OSTEEN: Well, you know, not any more. We’ve learned it doesn’t work.
HANNITY: All right. Thank you both for being with us.
V. OSTEEN: Thank you.
HANNITY: Appreciate it. Good to see you both again.
J. OSTEEN: OK, Sean. Thank you.
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